When Craigslist attacks!

I have researched using Craiglist from top to bottom. From trying to find a friend who likes hiking the area trails to purchasing furniture and musical instruments. The problem really is not them - the problem is the naive presumption that any public forum where you will contact or be contacted by someone from it is "fun" and safe. It is not.

Criminal and malicious elements flood into these type sites - even from our jail systems computer access points.

Then try posting any intelligent opinion on any forum offered - you will be insulted, cursed, demeaned, called every offensive vulgar political and sexual stereotype that the person can muster up to serve to you on their next rant - then "god forbid" that you click on a posting with a pic - it may be anything from full frontal nudity showing all the "bits and pieces" to a cartoon character of a woman being sexually tortured or a man sodomized, to who knows what!

... and that is the point. This type of medium is dangerous and it is out of reasonable and rational control. Yet, then is not much of American media also outside of reasonable and rationale control of our words and actions. Free speech is unquestionable and good. Vulgarity, obscenity, full public nudity these things are not acceptable in a civilized society for good and healthy reasons and should not be considered as "free speech" any more than sexist, racist or threatening words or actions towards and other citizen would be considered legal use of free speech rights.

CL could do more to prevent the mess but then they in no way could offer the site for free. It would take an army of sensors and reviewers to remove the offensive material. Maybe that is what the problem really is. The myth of the FREE web experience. Did it ever work out that way? What happened to all the good FREE stuff on the web over the last 10 years? Most of it was abused, perverted and disbanded or went out of business - it is a bad business model.

Here is a hated idea. Remove the FREE sites from the web and you will remove most of the problems. Charge and you know whom you are doing biz with and the really strange and offensive ones will probably not bother with the site - how many can they afford to join? After they lost their money and got dunned a penalty fee for their bad behavior the first time around - would they bother coming back? Let's come up with some better ways of doing this then "front end free" - back end mess . . .

I signed off of CL last night and will not go back to using it for any resource. It is just too much hassle dealing with the low life on it.

Before CL there were newspaper ads that were faked. And they cost $$. It is impossible to completely eliminate those who will try and take advantage of you. No amount of policing can do that. Sure, CL can work hard to decrease the problem, but it will never go away. It is the users responsibility to use due diligence when dealing with the online community.

The problem is with CRIMINALS. And criminals do what criminals do, which is to generally screw everything up for the rest of us....because they're criminals. It's what criminals do. Their self interests conflict with ours.

Some of "us" need to put ourselves in the victim's place once in a while, just to realize that internet-related crimes, are crimes.

Therapeutic service category has become another place for prostitutes. I am a licensed Massage Therapist and posted comments,state statutes and laws to educate the public looking for massage. All of them have been removed. 2 were flagged by unlicensed individuals & I believe CL themselves removed the others. CraigsList is such BS. The fact that they would Censor an educated comment regarding licensed vs unlicensed individuals offering massage service is pure BOGUS. I hope that no Licensed legitimate Massage Therapist would dare advertise on CL. I sure as HE!! would not

there are two completely different issues on the table with CL. 1) the criminals - yes they will do what they will do - anywhere - anytime. Charging will make it more difficult and traceable. 2) public FREE access to post any publicly offensive material at will. No other media including newspapers, tv, cable etc is allowed this freedom - because it does not exist under our laws. Every other median is held liable for that material. The excuse that because it is on the "www" and FREE it is a civil right is outdated and not valid. You will have to offer that same right to all other media or end up with the same regulations on the web. I for one have had enough. I will not use free sources like this any more. I would pay for a membership on CL to access and use the resource if they would edit it and monitor content. Lets put something else out there that is absolutely absurd. When you click into any of the "adult" content areas all you do is claim you are over 18 - there is no way to validate that - that is absurd - any rational person knows a child who can type on a key board and use their brain will just say yes and look at that stuff out of curiosity - so - in reality the system does not prevent children access to those areas - the system does not work - it is broke - it was never set up right to begin with.

CL is just like anything else if it is not your cup of tea then don't drink it! I for one have met several people from CL. Most of them are older, white professional gentlemen. Not everyone on CL is a lowlife or criminal. CL has many different areas to visit if you don't like the Erotic Services section then don't click on it! Prostitution has been around since the beginning of time and it is never going away. If there wasn't a demand for it then it would fade away. CL gives women/men the opportunity to interview a prospect before meeting with them. This is much safer than being on a street corner being picked up by someone and possibly getting into a life threatening situation! If CL needs to be shut down because of prostitution the all of the other web sites that offer escorts need to be shut down as well!

The people that wanted to believe something was available for nothing are to blame along with the people that placed the ad. The same ad could be place many places. CL is NOT the only site where you can place ads like this. There are the Green Sheets everywhere.

Craigslist is as bad as freedom.

The problem is the professionals have all but taken over the women for men sections in our areas. It is not an exaggeration to state as high as 90% are fakes where the person sends a form response linking you to their porno site pics or at best their dating site where you would need to sign up and join to talk to them (they apparently are paid a commission for bringing you in).

Then if I post an ad (even just for a friend to hike with) I get the scammers from all over - asking for help $$, phishing for info, names, addresses, the like ... so the absurdity and possible harm outways the value - it would seem exceptionally dangerous for women.

As far as your comments if I do not like it leave it. That is the typical naive response - I am not referencing only myself I am referring the greater good and well being of our society and our children. Do you have the same attitude toward them as you do adults? If they are not smart enough to figure it out it's their problem? Do you just blame it on the parents? I am suggesting that the sign-in model is flawed and not practical. All the major community sites are facing this same issue now - the predators sign on as teens - the teens as adults - we need more identification required - a thumb print - a certified and registered IP or some other validate - it is time to discuss it and develop the technology application to put it in place.

We have not even brought up the issue of spammers, phishiers, hackers, etc in foreign countries accessing our sites and pcs for malicious reasons with little real prevention - please do not bring up firewalls, virus software and parental control software - I have been in the industry from the beginning and none of these work that well for numerous and complex reasons.

" freedom abused is ultimately the path to freedom surrendered and lost

I have two comments:
1) I used CL to find a roommate to rent out a room in the house I own, and it was a VERY helpful and useful tool. And it was free (as a bonus). I would not have spent money posting ads in a newspaper, and I was just more familiar with CL than with other websites, so it was very easy for me to use as well. CL is not bad entirely. So for those people who are giving it so much crap, don't generalize. And I agree with Alexis...if you don't like the erotic ads, don't use them or view them. Prostitution is nothing new. Sure it is more blatantly advertised on CL, but pick up a newspaper and look in the classified section and you will see numerous ads for escorts and prostitution that are less blatant but still clear enough to any adult with a brain that can tell that an ad that says "Young hot Asian girls will massage you and give you the ultimate pleasure" are hardly the ads of professional, trained and certified massage therapists.

2) My second comment is...does "Techy" have ANYTHING better to do than to respond to every comment on this post with a four or five paragraph monologue about his or hers quest to improve the "greater good and well being" of society? How sweet techy, what a noble martyr you must be. Maybe YOU need the help of one of CL's many prostitutes, to help relieve some of that stress you obviously have built up inside you!

craigslist give's everyone insight into the cesspool that is America's intellect. the dumbing down of american is on display for all to see. you can shut it down but the scum is still out there in the populace.

See that is what I am talking about. Because this site is free and you are anonymous you take the "liberty" to personally attack and malign someone because I bring up the real issues and try to present some intelligent debate to the resolution.

The same thing is being repeated all over the web in these type formats right now. I suggest that this is not a good use of your "freedom" of speech. Is it not just a cover for your anger and malice towards anyone who differs from your opinion? I speak to YOU as a PERSON with respect.

The subject matter is current and very important. Ones man life and home was wrecked by a model that is deficient - yet the liability is shifted to others. Newspapers "edit" the content - it is very unlikely something like that would ever get into print.

Here we go. I didn't mention the erotic category. I said the prostitutes are now posting under the THERAPEUTIC category. Geesh. Let these women and men stay in the erotic category & stay out of the therapeutic one! And when you try to educate people in that category you get flagged & removed. Such BS. So much for freedom of speech on CL.

BTW techy I appreciate your logic & insightful comments

i've used Craigslist to search for jobs and to buy/sell concert tickets, and not once have i ever encountered anything out of the ordinary. all the interviews i had were with real companies, not scams. as far as the ticket sales, i always got either my money or my tickets without any mishaps.

when i had to find a new place to live this past Fall, i decided to attempt the "find a random roommate on Craigslist" scenario. i was very lucky to not only wind up in a great part of the city, but also with a roommate who isn't a total psycho or lame ass. so you see, it's not so bad.

i do like reading the Missed Connections. they can be rather amusing.

CL has been quite useful on the employment front, when I've been looking for supplemental gigs to teaching. My wife has also had a lot of success on these. And I've both disposed of and acquired merchandise via CL. Similar listings in the local fishwrap have proved much less successful and have cost much more in terms of time and $$$.

But I understand the yukky stuff is there, too. I've been safe, so far, because I stay out of such neighborhoods. The only time I clicked on the erotic section was an attempt to research which cities had the most ads from pros there vs the cities that were "cleaner." My hypothesis that they would closely track the crime statistics proved false. (Sorry, Dallas!) Otherwise, it's like life - you need to keep your eyes open and not go looking for trouble, and you'll be ok.

Censored - my profound sympathies. I've generally found that looking for holistic centers is a better medium for finding massage therapists (real ones!), vs. random chance. The City Paper has a section here in Baltimore for massage, and it is just as slimy as CL. Good luck!

To Techy. I understand your concerns but, is your solution to dumb everything down to where it's not a danger to children? Should we then put fences along the sides of all roads because children are not yet aware enough to always look both ways? (Say what you will but, roadways are by far a greater danger to children that is CL). Society is inherently dangerous to children. Clearly they need to be protected but, it's not likely that we can staunch the flow of society or technology.

Much of our lives and daily routines are affected by corporate activities. To a large extent, companies provide the food we eat, the water we drink, the necessities and luxuries of everyday living. Increasingly, particularly with growing privatisation, it is not the State that provides these amenities - but companies.When you have a company you have a responsibility. Just as individuals owe a duty not to harm or injure others in society without justification, so too do companies owe a duty not to poison our water and food, not to pollute our rivers, beaches and air, not to allow their workplaces to endanger the lives and safety of their employees and the public, and not to sell commodities, or provide transport, that will kill or injure people.Craigslist has a responsibility to protect people from spammers and scammers.

Police should be thanking Craigslist for making their job so easy.

I too have heard of success stories with Craigs List. Mine is NOT one of them.

I applied for a job that was listed in the Administrative/Clerical Section of Craigs List. After an initial contact expressing interest in my resume, I was then solicited to, among other things, pose nude, try out adult toys, appear on a webcam -- the entire gamut.

Not only did I report him to Craigs List, I also suggested that he try advertising elsewhere. In the interim, he has my resume and address. Quite an unsettling feeling.

If it is of some interest to you, I would be more than glad to forward to you the e-mail that "Tax-Ellis" sent to me. It was quite offensive, had nothing to do with the job he advertised and, as I am self-employed, he robbed me of my time since I pay myself.

Craigs List started out as a great forum, unfortunately they do not police the site as they should. People who are looking for legitimate work should not be subjected to such ________— from people who have nothing better to do than to play games using their website.

Incidentally, I made the mistake of posting a resume on Craigs List. It was a mistake. Don't do it.

Just sign me turned off to Craigs List.

FET

I've used Craigslist for a while. Very few problems. When there are problems, or I see something that is OBVIOUSLY wrong, I report it.

Word of advice: -NEVER post your address or directions. -Report ANYTHING that has an address or a map to a specific location.
-Use the craigslist email reply, whenever possible as it hides your email.
-When you get legitimate sounding responses, offer a phone number.
-Arrange a time when you and the other party are able to meet each other for the exchange.
-Try to have someone with you when you pick up the item.
-Get a generic receipt book (with carbon copies) for the exchange, so both parties can sign that an item is being taken. Have one, whether you are buyer or seller.
-Add the small statement at the bottom of your advertisement: Seller reserves the right to cancel ad or refuse sale prior to Final Exchange. *Final Exchange being Paid Receipt or Bill of Sale signed by both parties.

Use these as courtesy and common use practices, and you will severely cut down problems that may arise from people willing to do any sort of malice.

I am increasingly convinced that people suck. I would never even think of entering someones property and taking anything. That is ridiculous. I have had two Nigerian scam artists trying to steal a couple of items i posted on Craig's list. i had a little fun with them and wasted their time. Nobody gives away anything of value. My strongest message to all of you who like me have trusted people in the past..... Don't. In this camp, nobody gets anything until it is paid for first.

Yes, the come and clean out the house happened to my brother and his wife people were showing up at 5:30 in the morning and they have kids that were scared to death someone should be policing Craigslist.

Calvin, craigslist will not allow a phone number or an address to be posted. Craigslist rocks! It is like a huge organized group chat and I use it daily. Of course there are criminals, EVERYWHERE. Not just craigslist. If someone uses it to break the law, they should be charged, but I don't think any censoring or "policing" is a good idea. Who knows what that would lead to. I feel very protective of craigslist because it is a whiff of what it might be like to take a breath in this country and not be charged or taxed.